FRUSTRATING ON 'OH' SO MANY LEVELS

his lack of awareness got him punched. he saw it to late, was scared, and got hit.

better he looked around him, walked out. or

smacked the bitch up, and put a ballpoint in the eye of the fat gorilla, and move to another city

Bing-Bang/UncloudedFall,

with you guys all the way--fence is my world that no one is allowed to
enter. after that we all may have other things important to us at varying
levels but here where i draw my line. whether it's a finger in her belly,
or a mild poke in his neck [i've done that, sort of made my hand look limp
but kept tension in the fingers and had a guy walk his neck onto my fingers...
very satisfying i can assure you...it has that certain je n'sais fook-off quality].

the rest is range dictated and one can save the barking for the shitsus and
poodles.

i should just pay you guys, it's like i just finished a therapy session.

Quote :

and one can save the barking for the shitsus and poodles

That line elicited a genuine laugh from me!

At this point in this world anybody so fucked up that they would walk into a place full of people and push in line must be deranged, I would figure I am dealing with a degenerate and leave it alone.One look at her would tell me there are two choices.Either you take people like that out the spot or you dont say a word, there is no mid ground with them.

chulodog wrote:

his lack of awareness got him punched. he saw it to late, was scared, and got hit.

better he looked around him, walked out. or

smacked the bitch up, and put a ballpoint in the eye of the fat gorilla, and move to another city

The girl's bruises heal, the gorilla can still see out of one eye.... but I have to move to another city? No offence, but this isn't my idea of SP tactics. But hey, that's just me

Russ quote: "it has that certain je n'sais fook-off quality"
Priceless mate, absolutely priceless!

Gotta say however, though I'm not sure what would or would not work in any given situation, I am somewhat uncomfortable with the 'only 2 options' mindset - no offense Danite. Of course you have to pick your battles, and I suspect most are worth walking away from, and a few are worth fighting for. But is that it?
Everyone here seems highly irritated by the general level of rudeness and uncivil behavior perceived to be the norm in society today, but does anyone believe that ignoring people, or giving them what for, is really going to change anything?
So, if what you want is for people to behave better, and the only thing you have any control over is your OWN behavior, what do you do with that?
Finally, I will say, that the knowledge that one is fully prepared to fight and defend oneself physically, or walk away, are both pre requisites for the stuff in between.

tactpro wrote:
The girl's bruises heal, the gorilla can still see out of one eye.... but I have to move to another city? No offence, but this isn't my idea of SP tactics. But hey, that's just me

it isnt your idea, because you maby never experienced a real life situation.
believe me, the ballpoint will do the trick,
and if you dont have a gang who can protect you from the revenge, from his friends. better move.

its real life self defence.

(police dont help you)

chulodog wrote:

tactpro wrote:
The girl's bruises heal, the gorilla can still see out of one eye.... but I have to move to another city? No offence, but this isn't my idea of SP tactics. But hey, that's just me

it isnt your idea, because you maby never experienced a real life situation.
believe me, the ballpoint will do the trick,
and if you dont have a gang who can protect you from the revenge, from his friends. better move.

its real life self defence.

(police dont help you)

I'm sure the ballpoint will do the trick. My favourite improvised weapon in fact. But the trick it will do will land me in deeper shit than simple threat avoidance.

Chulo, you do realize that gang warfare and hooliganism is NOT self protection, dont you?
You've obviously had lots and lots of street fights. And admittedly, this site is called 'streetfight'secrets.com... but you've got to realize that getting into lots of fights doesn't qualify you to teach others how to NOT get into fights.

no, but like the one eye is king in the land of blind.

if you not even capeble to protect yourself, how can you teach others?
and thinking about the consequence after is also sp

thats why my earlier comment was, just leave the pizza , and walk out.
AVOID THE DRAMA SCENE

but IF you decide to fight the gorilla, better be rude.

and the consequence can be its better for your health to move.

Sp is not only deal with the situation on that moment, also think about the (early) future.

... but you've got to realize that getting into lots of fights doesn't qualify you to teach others how to NOT get into fights.


its just like all oldfashioned ma scools,

i thought this site was for the realistic ones who GET in a fight and how to handle it.

not about running away, and avoiding, because of youre a chicken./ wise or wathever.

and ask my students, youre right, i dont teach them how not to fight


i teach them to fight, and they fought effectivly, and be able to protect themselves and their colleague

yeah youre right, in my opinion this all forum is about how to.

i liked richie s style because he showed the real deal , and not lala land

If I may gentlemen...?


Chulo you can make a point without saying "maybe you dont have much real world experience"- its unnecessary

Chulo's point however (after I reread his post a couple of times) is valid... I read it as : make a decision fight or walk out DONT play this silly passive aggressive middle ground

Which I mainly agree with: the man with the phone is being a cock (I swtiched from "dick" to ensure the googlebots get enough keywords to pick us up)- the only people who are allowed to use passive aggressive strategies are adolscent shcool girls

did he even give the guys running the pizza parlour a chance to sort it out their own way? let them do it! its their place and he was under no threat, maybe she wanted change, or to just by a can ... or I dont know... maybe she is a toe rag who jumps queues, boo hoo.

blinding someone in one eye is not good self protection when it will get you banged up for excssive force

Im not sure how serious a suggestion it was anyway

But (i think) Chulo's point was... 1. Walk out 2. Fight but DONT start shit by bitching loudly like a little girl and then when it gets out of your control pretend it isnt happening

anyway


by my score card, full points go to Sifu Maija on this one

maija wrote:

OK, so a couple ideas to get y'all to comment on.
Armchair psychologist hat says our homegirl here has low self esteem, does not get listened to much, or taken seriously, and is used to fighting for attention using verbal and physical threat. Also aligns herself with homeboy sized company to get her out of situations, again re affirming her self worth.
So you make some under your breath 'diss' that she overhears. Seems like ignoring a person like this is destined for trouble. Hell, I'D get irritated if someone I was trying to engage pretended I was not there.
So what about putting your hand out - "Hi, my name's 'whatever', I in no way meant to offend you. It seems like you must be in a hurry whereas I am not, please feel free to take my place". Then smile widely. (I have to say that having an English accent here in the States works wonders on occasion)
If the harassment continues, engage the rest of the crowd - "Hey guys, this lady seems to be in a hurry, are you (touching shoulder or making eye contact with a particular person here) OK with letting her move ahead? How about you (point at them). 2 fold advantage of making the problem everybody's and disconnecting from the direct confrontation. Now, there is the risk I guess of now causing a complete riot! But I suspect most people in there were not up for that.
Thoughts anyone?

pwnage

Yeah, I like maija's approach on this one too. It's a good recovery tactic, should a mistake such as this ever be made.

Obviously, passive/aggressive 'Hilfiger' boy didn't see 'Shamoo' (lol, Russ that's classic) outside and factor him into the equation, and thought he could call her a 'bitch' (which she is) and not own up to it. I hate that crap. If someone is gonna run their mouth they should own up to it, not try and pretend it didn't happen. That just pissed her off... he could have diffused it right then and there... oh well... idiot.

...and on the flip side drama queens like that too often pull these kind of stunts. I've seen a few first hand and they always have a goon waiting in the wings to come and 'rescue' them.

I don't really feel sorry for anyone in this situation... like attracts like I guess.


on another note. Didn't know you were a fellow cyclist there Russ!! I fight the good fight every day to and from work... good times indeed Major practice grounds for de-escalation techniques lol and fence work all around

D.M.B. wrote:

on another note. Didn't know you were a fellow cyclist there Russ!! I fight the good fight every day to and from work... good times indeed Major practice grounds for de-escalation techniques lol and fence work all around

yup, nothing raises the blood sugar like cycling it's a nice warm up for training too. i always remember a guy--one of the best sports/street fighters i'd ever met actually, used to cycle every
where. he'd always appear refreshed, loose, and a wee bit hyper. i'd liked alot about his balance
to training and 'tweeking'. in sports, he always ranked and trophied but never got to the top of the sports food chain. in the street, i don't remember any but him prevailing. he's the guy i sometimes reference that two guys tried to jump/mug once--he was issuing them both such a beating that when the cops came, they believed 'them' [of course, the winner has to be the bad guy--poor defenseless muggers],
they threw my friend in local jail for a bit of time. that was an animal who really knew how to live
he did alot of door work later. i can't even imagine how that turned out, but i have an idea. he's also the guy who had to spend a year in court for killing someone with the gun that was used to hold him up with. the 'expert' should have been able to come up with other options, hmmm

all that to say that he cycled everywhere, believed it kept him sharp...and i suppose it did. i wasn't going to be the retard who questioned him

Russ, to me the problem is this.there are many people these days that will kill over some ego issue wrapped around an argument over a cheesburger.our socities have become a jungle, I assume the worst.I never argue with any assholes anywhere at anytime.if I dont like whats happening around me I leave.I assume the worst and act accordingly.While I agree with your value system, things are far beyond any remedial action that anyone of us can take.Society is f...d so I act accordingly.

I share Danite's point of view on that one. TPI has a concept of a normal looking crimial sociopath who is ex-special forces, obsessed with training and violence, etc or whatever. The nightmare enemy. Just so you don't let your guard down and grow complacent. They call him Todd.

What I see that is about 90% more common is Todd's retarded cousin, I called him Dodd. The perfectly normal guy that you don't expect anything of, that suddenly blows a fuse and does something moronic and completely fucked up. And this guy is everywhere. In your own family. At work. You'll meet him on the way to the grocery store. The guy Danite is talking about that will kill over a cheeseburger.

I'll do nothing to invite that mofo into my world.

RichardB/Danite,
i'd be a booger if i didn't understand exactly what you're saying. i get it. it's based on safety first; picking one's battles...just don't know where one draws the line. i'm sort of operating on what i know
to be self honesty. whilst i relate to you guys, and consider you guys "US" and those degenerate
half witts "THEM", i've seen a pattern within myself to no longer have patience to tip toe around people's
mental illnesses and poor rationalizing based on having their collective experiences that are built from
years of not being called on it. when i arrived in DC it was prevelent. someone does something fooked
up and everyone is warning me, "don't fight back...don't say a word...just walk away". i hate what it does to my psychie. they're not monsters, they can be stopped and should be. and yeah, if i can walk away great. i'm not going to get all macho if i can help it--and possibly withstand an injury. but my fence dictates, and my words will say [one way or another], 'kindly fook off now...whatever your problem is, it's not mine, don't make it mine'.

i think that's my main objection, i've seen all these people getting away with this for SO long, that i start to wonder, "well...who's calling them on it...because i don't even see the cops calling them on it all the time". there's some kind of 'naturalizing' dumbing affect that is so pervasive that all i want is to claim my right to say, "sorry, i'm not playing...pick someone else...nkay? bye-bye". i'm sure i set myself limits, but i'd have to say that i'd end up in something of the same predicament from simply saying something about 'butting in line', asking for girly to step back--too close sorry, and i really can't speculate any more than that. i'm sure i'd be filling the gaps with, "look, i'm not looking for a fight, really...but you need to back up because i'm not THAT person...i'm just not". i can even imagine myself joking and saying, "not trying to get into a fight with you big fella" whilst at the same time keeping my fence, "but back up anyway, nkay?"

what we say and what we do is probably hard to pinpoint, but i'm guessing this trap could befall us all. i'm really not trying to get into a situation where i'd have to find a new carry out and look over my shoulder if it was simply avoidable, and here my point,
but i'm also not trying to tip toe around this local fookwitt either. it's a tight rope walk and i desire not to fall from either side of the rope. i'm the guy that just needs to be left alone, that's all i ask. it's what i've been watching my character turn into. so i have to be honest about what i do--even if i could just as easily agree with all of your very reasonable and practical answers.

i'm with you guys even in theory, i'm just a wee bit fed up treating a turd like a royal. they want my respect, try giving it first. i let people off the hook regularly as soon as they show signs of humanity. sorry for being wordy--i'm sleep deprived. nite guys my bed is calling me.

Chulo

Agree with you on the post-fight theory. It's good to know what to do after a situation to prevent come-backs / revenge. I've got a couple of insurance policies for certain situations.

Not sure why you don't teach your guys to avoid trouble, but I'm not going to ask. You teach fighting, I teach SP... whatever.

Other than that, I agree with what Richie said

Peace

I like how you put it Russ.
I am with you to the extent that I think there are the walk away, ignore, and fight moments, but I also believe there are also shades of gray in between. A tightrope indeed on some level, more risky if you guess wrong, but better for my own psyche, and perhaps society too ......

i'm just a wee bit fed up treating a turd like a royal

I treat turds very much like turds. "I am NOT touching that."

But I get what you're saying.

I look at the world and just shake my head, then decide to be entirely selfish apart from every other exception. If it isn't my problem, I have no problem, and everything is cool. Damn near anything goes, so long as they leave me out of it. If I see a turd start inching it's way toward me on the road, I'm dealing with it as if it's a full-blown Dodd laying it's crooked, shifty-eyed crosshairs on me. The scary thing about Dodd's is that they start out as people, just like zombies. Then for whatever reason they are turned. If you look real close at just the right time, you can spot them at the twitcher stage. Hearing the ego warping inside them like tired metal on a sinking ship. then you can act pre-emptively. Whether that entails heading for the door or putting their head through the door. In any case my priorities can be boiled down to not getting turd on me, and I'm not going to be the guy cleaning up all that turd either.

But the reason the streets, floors, walls, benches, windows and stairs are all covered in turd is that a lot of people simply take this path. And that few take up the garden hose and go to war. Ah, "war on turds!" Maybe that is the next big political stunt. If everyone refused to let a turd lie just on their own property, where, oh where would a turd go?

Then again the real problem with that whole deal if you want to look at it large scale isn't the turds, it's the assholes who make them in the first place. Because they just keep pinching them out at the same rate you get rid of them.

Maija/RichardB,

and that's why we all get on so well...

shades of grey and tightropes

Dodd's and doo-doo's

no grey in our communications, who needs a bloody thesaurus?

there is a difference between self protection which has to assume high levels of threat, lack of choice and an element of desperation/ survivalism

and good citizenship, being a good person/ role model and the various overtones that the name of the site "street fight secrets" might pick up... like vigilantism or being some kind of tubby batman

In the case of the clip which started the thread this is not a "self protection" example as such, its more of a "how shall we deal with antisocial morons?" issue (where phone man also falls into the bracket of antisocial morons)


and that is where some of the wires are being crossed between people and within peoples own heads I reckon


Personally, I think if you CAN do something, it behooves you to DO something in a situation- now that is NOT pure "self protection" because self protection is "selfish"...

(unless you are an evolved being and have a sense of self that extends beyond the boundaries of your own self perception to the collective consciousness )

the survivalists will stand on one side of the argument and be totally correct, the aspiring bhoddisatvas will stand on the other and be just as correct

comes down to your objectives really

I like Maijas advice, but I bet if you plonked me in that situation I wouldn't have said anything, there was nowhere near enough motivation shown to get confrontational in the way sleeping phone man did.

Its a take out maybe in a rough area, its busy, people will be drunk, they are hungry, impatient to get served, fights break out easily... take it easy, dont lose persepctive better yet just go somewhere else ... better still: go home.

good purist self protection does NOT include waiting in queues in dodgy pizza parlours late at night now does it?

"you run with the bulls you might get knocked out by a massive fat man with a mouthy bird" as noone has ever said to me.
Wisdom like this sticks with you for life, you know?

whats TPI?

no problem tactpro!

but my training is based on fighting yes.

if i trained them not to fight i would send them to church or so.


and i like the idea of not fighting, but for the doorman, or selfprotection, it s handy to know how to fight.

all the talking and how to talk, is part training part experience, i cannot learn that, they have to find out themselves, or find a teacher who can teach them that.

okay i thought you was just another guy who give lessons in what he thinks is fighting because of training.

i never take a tattoo from somebody who got no tattoos himself,

in my past, i made a mistake to hurt a wrong guy, my whole house was smashed to pieces, by members of a dutch/turkish gang. (still paying)

that is what i liked to say. sp is not only that particilar moment!

think forward.


Sp like you say, can only do with strangers, on holiday, or in a city you dont know many people.

and in this case he know the bitch, and myby the gorilla also, so if the big guy has powerfull friends, its impossible to hurt him. better he has left the building.

or blocked the punch, and push him, and run away.

if you teach self protection, i dont see difference with surviving a fight.
if you like to train jason bourne escape way, its cool

if this guy would escape from the situation to change the mindset from the bitch, or fat guy, he just had to hit an innocent stranger next to him, and walk out
confusion everywhere!

try it, it works

Richie, Russ and Richard B, I wish, i truly do wish that I lived in a different kind of society.By nature I am a very social person, and dont mean partying I mean a social person.I am aghast at what our societies have become.I feel that being in the public space as things are now requires a survivalist mindset why? there are simply to many people who are down to the level of looking for conflict as a way to resolve a whole range of things. People who will not think twice about killing or injuring another person over a "look" or a 'glance"Human life and respect for others means nothing anymore, our societies have become weak and degenerate. it is no longer about bad manners, it is about somebody using bad manners as a way to provoke what could be lethal cionflict over his or her personal problems.Am I to be fodder for their pathologies?.I have to agree with Richard B here, these days anybody even looks at me crooked I move out of the area right away.its not about treating these turds like royalty, it is about saving yourself from morons who will destroy their lives and the lives of others in second over their fucked up personality problems.I stay far far far away from even the merest hint of crap blowing my way.Or like with cops, I NEVER argue with cops , NEVER, I dont care if they are wrong and I am right, they have power and they are also becoming inceasingly sociopathic, Survival means putting ego and morality aside and looking at things as an animal on the savannah does ie cost -benefit analysis. That being said if I saw a blatant massacre of humanity going on I would probably intervene in some way, like maybe throw rocks from across the street as I shiled my face from the freaks view as I scream at the top of my lungs and draw the maniac away from the victim, something like that.

okay, consensus is to see the makings of the bird-n-bull show--take the early warning to go 'ome
and make some egg and chips. taking into account that if their hooptie [broken down car] is left
unattended, that this is an opportunity to urinate on the driver's seat whilst heading home