ZULU STICK FIGHT

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vH600iNUHE&feature=related

FYI:DAGA=MARIJUANA
SINCE THE COMMENT SAYS THESE GUYS FIGHT AFTER BEER AND DAGA

AFRIKAANS PRONUNCIATION OF 'G'...LIKE THE GUTTERAL GATHERING OF PHLEM IN THE
BACK OF YOUR THROAT

FASTER PACE WITH LESS DAGA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8k1N2xMZ0KQ&feature=related


EDITED///

WHAT THE HELL IS THIS...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZ3lSblnm-w

or more specifically this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6DxWMx4MYo8&feature=related

hysterical...now it's my favorite show--whatever IT is. sort of fightquest meets aboriginal culture
i wonder how much rigor still exists in aboriginal fight traditions

I'M INTRIGUED AND REPELLED AT THE SAME TIME, HAS ANYONE SEEN IT?

Seems perfectly normal to me, after copious amounts of beer and Daga my friends and I do similar things. Like throwing darts at each other and attempting to catch them. Then there is shock billiards, where if you don't make the shot you called you get tased. Then there is the favorite... punch me in the head and I'll ask for another game.

roadkill wrote:

Seems perfectly normal to me, after copious amounts of beer and Daga my friends and I do similar things. Like throwing darts at each other and attempting to catch them. Then there is shock billiards, where if you don't make the shot you called you get tased. Then there is the favorite... punch me in the head and I'll ask for another game.

i like your friends

i used to play chicken alot. similar mental state, knife thrown closest to foot before someone 'chickens' out.
invariably someone gets mildly hurt from being too stupid to chicken out --it's been years, but thanks for
that flashback

Me likes. Last man standing is quite a popular show over here. I like it a lot. Esp when you see the arrogant and ego-strong contestants (no offence, but they happen to be the American ones in this case) eat humble pie. The guys do actually have some semi-spiritual experiences along the way.... as you do when you put your self through such hardships.

With regard to the stick fighting, I'd like to have a go. Esp because it's a genuinely historical and cultural sport/fighting system. Unlike one of your previous posts, Russ
I can't help but think though, based on my experiences with FMA, that if those sticks were shorter (30inches) and they put those shields down (i.e Filipino style), there would be bodies littering the ground at the end of those tournaments

First series of last man standing was ace, the 2nd I didnt find any of the characters as likeable apart from Oxbridge guy. Good attitude. Did you watch that similar Man or Chicken thing on BBC3 recently, Globe trotting around to do "REAL mans " jobs. Attrocious! I personally wanted to beat that whinging vegitarian bloke into fucking rubble, psychic vampire , that guy.

Anyway, Zulu stick fighting is cool & dangerous. I have on my wall behind me a knobkerrie which I Granddad brought back from WWII when he was stationed out there, formidable club, it even has a notch carved in it.



Similar to this. Very heay head, crush a skull no worries.

They are still much in use today.

Quote :

I personally wanted to beat that whinging vegitarian bloke into fucking rubble, psychic vampire , that guy.

I'd have helped you mate. Saw a bit on one episode (in Japan with the monks on the mountain). Don't really watch TV anyway. But I saw a few mins of that one and just wanted to kill that (wo)man.

Pet peeve of mine: emotionally needy neurotic men.

Cool story about your grandad though. I like old/antique weapons. Esp if they may have been used in actual combat (is that weird?). Not that I collect them or anything...

Sharif H wrote:

Quote :

I personally wanted to beat that whinging vegitarian bloke into fucking rubble, psychic vampire , that guy.

Pet peeve of mine: emotionally needy neurotic men.

Cool story about your grandad though. I like old/antique weapons. Esp if they may have been used in actual combat (is that weird?). Not that I collect them or anything...

i thought it was easier just to say ME-TOO.

...what other weapons are on your wall Matt [Blakops]?
i used to have arrow heads, spear heads, a nice leather bound knife [all from equatorial africa], a crazy arabic dagger...and probably some other things i've forgotten [oh yeah, a real boomerang--not pretty, and heavy; and an officer's kuhkri]. over time, all lost, nicked, etc...by family, etc...i guess with small kids now, i have to accept the plus side of that. i think you're making me want to rebuild though. [i'll admit the leather bound traditional dagger smarts...had it at my mum's and when she passed i didn't want to quibble over it when my bro surreptitiously nicked it--perhaps not knowing it was mine.
not what you think of at a time like that so it just sort of stayed in his house unchallenged]. funny what comes to mind over one wee reference

regarding stick fighting.
i like how those shields were used--sort of spinning a bit making one see the wisdom in the protruding spikey bits [to catch
the stick and wrench it from a hand or trap it for a second]. that's a heck of a weapon Blakops. i tend to like things end weighted. i got really attatched to my gurka knife for it's weight. i didn't care that it was blunt--for all intensive purposes it was better that way. i used to have it by my bed the way some keep a bat--for that mid dream surprise that needs augmenting to get something going. like having extra long hands--really heavy hands. what a jump start, i tell you

Nice clips Russ, very cool - love the way the shield is designed and used.

A friend of mine who spent time in Africa also has one of those knobkerries, called it a 'knocker'. Great weapon.

Yes they are Maija. Never going to be used as one though, or I would never see it again.

I have a large maglite copy now, if I ever need a club following an incident last year with my son's mini baseball bat.

Thought it was wiser to get something more innocent in appearence.

I have a few large boomerangs up, Rus, that my Grandad made. They work excellently, I have more than a few boomerangs of different design about the place, actually. I pick them up 2nd hand & occasionally J & I will take them & some kites & and go & throw & fly.

But apart from them no weaponary adorning my wall. I like masks though, got a few from all over.
I got rid of the knives I collected as a teenager when Jago was born, didnt want them hanging around & then funnily enough started camping regularly so ended buying a couple of different types. I like CRKT so bought a small fixed blade & an M16 (excellent knife). That has had to stop as my last purchase got seized by customs. In the bottom of the tool box is foot long kukri/parang copy from China, so much more useable than a hatchet for camping & outdoor work. Everyday in the pocket is a Leatherman Juice Pro, bought to relace the victorinox I got nicked. Fantastic tool. Gets a lot of use & legal, the small glasses screwdriver is a god send

I would like to collect some weaponary, watching antique shows they retain value very well. A proper service Kukri would be lovely, though I have never seen one to buy. Only cheap mass produced copies, which you can usually find at any car boot sale. Not worth purchasing.

The terrible allure of harware, ehh, girls & boys. If I lived in the States, it would probably be guns. OOOOOOOOOOOh the power!!!

Clip of Burton Richardson breaking down some techniques in Zulu stickfighting. He also shows how some of this carries over to Kali.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_qgilAJi4U&feature=related

The Zulu stick fighting stuff didn't look that interesting to me at first, maybe due to the whippy sticks they were using and so on. But the more information that has landed in this thread, culminating with that last video, the more it looks like that too has something to offer.

Thanks for posting that clip Karunamama - it was nice to see the slow mo as it showed the tactics so much better.
Definite similarities with cane work and particularly sword, because the defensive line is so important.

maija wrote:

Thanks for posting that clip Karunamama - it was nice to see the slow mo as it showed the tactics so much better.
Definite similarities with sword, because the defensive line.

ditto and good to know. i was watching it and enjoying the clip all the more for the recap in slo mo. i'd have missed
the subtle flick-over at the forearm, and just assumed force, etc... i was also wondering about how the sticks came
about--as a practice for bolos?? anyway, it got me thinking about machetes, which got me thinking it may not be such
a side show and hobby after all--previously assumed so by myself. oops.

so this goes to Maija,
i've seen you work that machete size sword--correlation for practical tools about?
do you always circle--is that a regional thing. is that what works best for in incharge for a bolo wielding
brute who doesn't know how to use his tool. to be able to side step, blade parry, and fiercely counter?
alot of questions i know, but this city has it's share of machetes and guns for some odd reason. so i was
more thinking out loud. i've been in aikido long enough to have several ideas about making it to ones target,
but again...not sure what really stuck as i was sort of in the " " mode, wanting the hand to hand class.
sacrilege to you i'm sure.

maybe a baseball bat. you must have some strong wrists. okay, now i'm all over the place with free flow thoughts.
going to work. answer what is up to speed, ignore what isn't worth your time

Glad you guys liked the clip. The slo mo and explanations definitely helped me, too. Here's another clip of Burton Richardson doing some Zulu stick sparring. There's a nice photo showing the result of one of the strikes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwivJ5OyoNw

Also, Cold Steel makes these
http://www.coldsteel.com/africanwalking.html

Don't have time to write much, the little one's going to be waking up any minute now. However, I'd like to say that if Maija's going to be talking about swords, that deserves it's own thread

Don't have much time, but as to your questions Russ -
Machetes are very tip heavy, but obviously work great!! There are specific machete fighting systems taught in both Venezuela and Colombia (Garrote), and Haiti. There's clips of both on youtube - don't have time to find them now, but they are both in my favorites section.
Circling? Well ...in general moving is a good idea - don't want an even playing field after all, and definitely don't want to eat one by accident.
Doesn't necessarily need to be circling, forward pressure is great, just don't stand still.
Baseball bat? Also works great, but you must learn to make the most of all it's attributes and not just think of it as a one range weapon a la baseball hitting.
Later ....

Cheers mate.
i remember visiting the bat question a long time ago and thinking that without the
skill sets, i'd be better off 'poking'. and with the machete, i'd be better off with forward
drive and really powerful swings that would crash through in spite of blocks. the only
thing that started me thinking was that if it got jammed somehow [maybe three people],
i woudn't want to let it go and be used on me so i'd be a bit curious how to procede, etc...

i'll check out the clips--tah. i miss my kuhkri. i gave it to my mate who i train with long ago
to keep me out of trouble [years back]. now i want one again. it's the perfect length, and weight.
i know it has it's limitations--not being a dagger and all, but some knives speak to me

do you wack/slash/stab at stuff for the wrist strength--or just light spar and depend on the sharpness?
or both?

okay, now i have to go to work--actually i'm at work so i'm really pushing it

you should do a thread about attacking with a blade...but i don't want you to feel pressured, or morally
compramised--perhaps titled 'agressive home invasion knife defense' for good measure. some things
i'll add to the home invasion thingy, now that i've calmed down a bit--daughter kept me up all night and took
the agro right out of me by way of sheer exhaustion, cheeky little thing

maija wrote:

Don't have much time, but as to your questions Russ -
Machetes are very tip heavy, but obviously work great!! There are specific machete fighting systems taught in both Venezuela and Colombia (Garrote), and Haiti. There's clips of both on youtube - don't have time to find them now, but they are both in my favorites section.
....

i'll have a look in your favs,
i just found this--which was a cool start [at your suggestion for haiti]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDZWotBO9zg

and the follow up
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIsBlfyxdw8&feature=related
really making that big fella dance.

i see the body moves as much as the blade--hopping about, very sensible. hand
behind, also practical if another blade is there.

i decided to pick the place that had a shite load of really off the wall violence--i read about haiti in college

Karunamama wrote:

Glad you guys liked the clip. The slo mo and explanations definitely helped me, too. Here's another clip of Burton Richardson doing some Zulu stick sparring. There's a nice photo showing the result of one of the strikes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwivJ5OyoNw

Also, Cold Steel makes these
http://www.coldsteel.com/africanwalking.html

Don't have time to write much, the little one's going to be waking up any minute now. However, I'd like to say that if Maija's going to be talking about swords, that deserves it's own thread

nice two clips Karunamama [a.k.a. Karen]
the first one had me laughing--it must be really intimidating to spar with someone
who is laughing and [as the clip says] inflicting a bruise that remained for 3 years of
discoloration.
i like the second one too, maybe i'll be ordering that, hmmm

i really like the feel of things weighted heavy at the end. okay off to teach, fooey, liking
this thread more and more.

Russ the Muss wrote:

maija wrote:

Don't have much time, but as to your questions Russ -
Machetes are very tip heavy, but obviously work great!! There are specific machete fighting systems taught in both Venezuela and Colombia (Garrote), and Haiti. There's clips of both on youtube - don't have time to find them now, but they are both in my favorites section.
....

i'll have a look in your favs,
i just found this--which was a cool start [at your suggestion for haiti]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDZWotBO9zg

and the follow up
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIsBlfyxdw8&feature=related
really making that big fella dance.

i see the body moves as much as the blade--hopping about, very sensible. hand
behind, also practical if another blade is there.

i decided to pick the place that had a shite load of really off the wall violence--i read about haiti in college

[in a clinical setting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rmyLReCabl4&feature=related ]
alot of feet-getting-out-of-the-way moves, not unlike zulu stick fighting. i guess that'd be the weak link, eh?

Rus, whats the law on defence in the home? Would your machete get you arrested? How far does your home extend under state of columbia law, to the boundary?

We don't have castle law here in the UK. You use a weapon on an unarmed burglar you will get charged, more than likely.

You use a weapon in the street you will get charged more than likely irrespective of the number of assailants if they are unarmed.

The reason I bought a big maglite was because I had to throw out two twats who entered my block of flats & started having a little party in the hallway, breaking my neighbours daughters bike & trying to sleep there, last year.

Was reading in bed about 1.30am & heard noises out in the stairwell, thought it was neighbours coming back. noise went on so long that I went to investigate & took a rounders bat with me. They were f****** about on the floor below, went down there & they were real aggressive & wouldnt go. I was getting to the point where I knew I was going to have to crack the the more aggressive of the 2 when my neighbour (he of the van incident) came out. He had been trying to watch them through the spyhole for twenty mins, thinking that they had come to tax him. Anyway no violence ensued but they were mouthy as f*** for another 20 mins until I told them I was phoning the police. The hyper aggressive one was out in a flash, (which makes me suspect he was out on license, should have used the police threat earlier. Note to self) Anyway, after I realized that if I had used the bat I would have been in shit. Hence I started looking for something more innocuous.

Great vids Karen. & great suggestions, Maija. Rus, if you have this big blade why is it unsharpened? You could always use the back edge as a club.

Thought about suggesting you make a knocker, shilleagh , knobkerry by getting a local hard wood sapling, digging it up & cutting of the roots to leave the root ball then stripping bark & sanding & shaping it to fit. Though a pick handle would be just as good & less effort. Even a hard wood limb with part of the trunk still attached & shaped. Sorry to hear about the attempted break in. Hope they have not tried again.

Blakops wrote:

Rus, whats the law on defence in the home? Would your machete get you arrested? How far does your home extend under state of columbia law, to the boundary?

We don't have castle law here in the UK. You use a weapon on an unarmed burglar you will get charged, more than likely.

You use a weapon in the street you will get charged more than likely irrespective of the number of assailants if they are unarmed.

The reason I bought a big maglite was because I had to throw out two twats who entered my block of flats & started having a little party in the hallway, breaking my neighbours daughters bike & trying to sleep there, last year. .

good bit of advice mate...i should find out. probably a machete weighs worse than a blade from the kitchen i 'happened'
to pick up--kinda like.

Roadkill, know anything about this? i'll research tonight on google after my wife leaves, my kids are asleep, the dishes are
washed, etc. etc. etc.

really worth looking into. i was certainly in a mood to just run in hacking--no lie. i'd always assumed that crooks in d.c.
have guns [so many of them do] and that in a person's house, the crook gets what he paid for. the whole 'right to bear
arms' thing. maybe i'm wrong, hmmm

Without specifics to your neck of the woods...

This statement will generally cover you in all 50 states when it come to the use of lethal force...

""Immediate otherwise unavoidable danger of death or grave bodily harm to the innocent."" In reality all you have to do is believe that your life or the life of another was in danger. But you better believe it.

That is even on the street... In your home its even broader than that. If they are in your home, you can almost safely assume they mean to cause grave bodily harm if they have broken into your home. How many times have you heard of such an event and they killed one or all in the house. Therefore if they broke in would you not think that they could kill you or your loved ones?




Better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

roadkill wrote:

Without specifics to your neck of the woods...

This statement will generally cover you in all 50 states when it come to the use of lethal force...

""Immediate otherwise unavoidable danger of death or grave bodily harm to the innocent."" In reality all you have to do is believe that your life or the life of another was in danger. But you better believe it.

That is even on the street... In your home its even broader than that. If they are in your home, you can almost safely assume they mean to cause grave bodily harm if they have broken into your home. How many times have you heard of such an event and they killed one or all in the house. Therefore if they broke in would you not think that they could kill you or your loved ones?




Better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

that's all i need, cheers mate

Well Russ ... looks like I've unleashed your inner pirate
Honestly there is alot to weapons training - each type/shape of weapon has a personality, a way it moves, it's strengths and it's weaknesses - possibly too much to go into here.
Ultimate aim, at least from my teacher's point of view, was to be able to put anything in your hand, rock, hammer, scissors, katana, machete, cane, kebab stick, whatever, and be able to use it effectively.
To answer a couple of your questions in general - a blade should be sharp and there is very little strength required to use it. Also, if you are wielding a machete or a sword of any nature, unless you are facing a trained samurai or a complete lunatic, you will not need to charge at them to the point of contact for them to exit stage left.
How to attack with a sword only becomes important if the other is also armed, and especially if they seem unconcerned ... in which case it is probably best to run, or lock yourself in a room (which is actually not a bad idea in the first place for home invasion scenarios).
Sticks, canes etc? ... Well it's always good to know a few things, but the overhead 'caveman' works pretty well all in all, just don't be a one hit wonder.
Weapons are fascinating IMHO - lots to learn!
Blackops - though you are right that a Maglite is less of an overt weapon to carry around, if you ever crown someone with it, it's still counted as a weapon. Like my friend said, when we were talking about legal carry for blades, he said it only makes a difference until you use it, then it's an issue whether or not it's 'legal' to carry.
By the way Russ, Mick Coup has an interesting thread on home invasion ..... but I can't find it right now.

cheers Maija,
my game plan sans-instruction was definitely the caveman thing--crashing through at an angle downward.

just looked this up--about to have to go back to cleaning up my house [doh!]

"District of Columbia Official Code 2001 Edition:
Current as of 12/9/2005 updated 2/6/06


District of Columbia - § 22-4504.
Carrying concealed weapons; possession of weapons during commission of crime of violence; penalty.
(a) No person shall carry within the District of Columbia either openly or concealed on or about their person, a pistol, without a license issued pursuant to District of Columbia law, or any deadly or dangerous weapon capable of being so concealed...



District of Columbia - § 22-4514.
Possession of certain dangerous weapons prohibited; exceptions.

(a) No person shall within the District of Columbia possess any machine gun, sawed-off shotgun, or any instrument or weapon of the kind commonly known as a blackjack, slungshot, sand club, sandbag, switchblade knife, or metal knuckles, nor any instrument, attachment, or appliance for causing the firing of any firearm to be silent or intended to lessen or muffle the noise of the firing of any firearms; provided, however, that machine guns, or sawed-off shotguns, and blackjacks may be possessed by the members of the Army, Navy, Air Force, or Marine Corps of the United States, the National Guard, or Organized Reserves when on duty, the Post Office Department or its employees when on duty, marshals, sheriffs, prison or jail wardens, or their deputies, policemen, or other duly-appointed law enforcement officers, including any designated civilian employee of the Metropolitan Police Department, or officers or employees of the United States duly authorized to carry such weapons, banking institutions, public carriers who are engaged in the business of transporting mail, money, securities, or other valuables, wholesale dealers and retail dealers licensed under § 22-4510.

(b) No person shall within the District of Columbia possess, with intent to use unlawfully against another, an imitation pistol, or a dagger, dirk, razor, stiletto, or knife with a blade longer than 3 inches, or other dangerous weapon.

(c) Whoever violates this section shall be punished as provided in § 22-4515 unless the violation occurs after such person has been convicted in the District of Columbia of a violation of this section, or of a felony, either in the District of Columbia or in another jurisdiction, in which case such person shall be imprisoned for not more than 10 years.




1996:

District of Columbia - 22-3214. (a) No person shall within
the District of Columbia possess any... switchblade
knife..."

pretty much broken every law at some point. switchblades, kuhkris, tantos...but not in years. and not being trying to necessarily either...i just keep being more and more surprized since there's such a preponderance of weapons in this city.

funny...