MMA attracting bad people? / Martial Arts Character-types?

First of all, I'd say that pretty much all the MMA characters I've trained with are lovely people. But then, I've only been involved with a small group.

It seems to me that whereas traditional arts (esp the 'soft' style ones) are full of gentle people who aren't really fighters (physically or mentally), the world of cage fighting/MMA seems to attract those who arent really interested in the rights and wrongs of violence but simply like to fight. I mean, look at some the knobs who go on the Ultimate Fighter show... getting drunk and trashing their house; these are the kinds of characters who may well start a fight in bar/club/street/whatever.

I thought I'd write this post after reading this...

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/21/20090928/tuk-cage-fighter-admits-53m-heist-role-6323e80.html

And I also remember reading a story earlier this year about two thugs who were robbing people around this area where I live. Their chosen method? One distracts by engaging the victim in conversation while Number Two sneaks up behind them and puts on a rear-choke. The victim wakes up to find all their valuables have been taken.

The way I see the whole martial arts world is in three broad categories. The lines can blur and the categories cross-over depending on the art but to me it (very generally) looks like this...

Traditional Martial Arts

Full Contact Sport Fighting

'Street based' Self Protection.

I guess what I'm asking is, would agree that there are general character-types that belong to each 'category'? And would you agree that the MMA and cage fighting world have the most amount of bad people?

I agree with what your saying but i've only trained a few places and in small groups regarding MMA. Generally i observed that the people who were into training MMA were there for violence rather than other classes i've attended. That being said Boxing and Thai boxng tended to attract the same kind of people. I found kickboxing much more balanced.

technics1210 wrote:

I agree with what your saying but i've only trained a few places and in small groups regarding MMA. Generally i observed that the people who were into training MMA were there for violence rather than other classes i've attended. That being said Boxing and Thai boxng tended to attract the same kind of people. I found kickboxing much more balanced.

I actually forgot to add in the original post that I think MMA will always attract 'streety' kind of lads simply because of the environment most clubs are in. It used to be that boxing gyms existed in the hardest parts of town - to give the local lads somewhere to apply their aggression more constructively.
But 'streety' doesn't have to mean immoral, does it? Or does it?

the biggest twats Ive come across have been in MMA and muay thai classes, but the flip side of that coin is that the most capable lads Ive come across have been in those environments... and that there are some really cool people involved too... and there are some right twats in the traditional MA and str33t cliques too

but I take your point, it can attract more meatheads, who have only spam and spunk between their ears, and major mummy issues

Richard Grannon wrote:

it can attract more meatheads, who have only spam and spunk between their ears, and major mummy issues

oh, you know i had to quote you on that one mate

Quote :

...who have only spam and spunk between their ears, and major mummy issues

Word!

Esp on the mummy issues thing. I also found these types of knobs when I had my very brief career in the security industry.

i've refrained from input because the bulk of those i've known have been the boxing and dojo
crowd. boxers i knew were thinking about fighting/fighting/fighting. dojo crowd were too, but
sort of in a fantasy about it--not causing trouble. sort of pulled punches and self love .

the few kickboxers i met were sort of, "i want to hit and be hit, meooooowwww" tattoo'd sorts
who had that 'right of passage' blessing from above--or below

the TWO MMA guys i know pretty well--one is a hood pure and simple, with a nick name of
PIT--who bragged of kicking someone's head in long after the fight was finished. the other
was a teacher who got fired out for [lightly] slapping a kid--he also had a history of anger management.
as for the mummy thing--all i can say is that girl's get creeped out by either of them, the former is
likely to beat up some guy for going out with a girl he has liked for ages, the latter has a steady
girl [who i have yet to see but must take loads of meds, or have been raised by wild dogs in the
serengetti--her man is just too socially, erm, flawed].

then there are three TKD guys who defy all hype about the sport/defense/whatever. they have all
been in huge amounts of trouble before, street fight really well, but i'm guessing sort of brought their collective personalities with them into the TKD world. all three are NOT high kickers and, UNTYPICALLY, use their hands REALLY well for follow up and finish. not a typical profile for a TKD enthusiast.

at least two had to relocate to get back on the path to, erm, civilization; and at least two were locked
up before. maybe they'd had gravitated to MMA--which didn't exist in their heyday.

BUT HERE'S THE REAL QUESTION:

WHERE DO WE PLACE OURSELVES IN ALL THIS

I STARTED TO ANSWER FOR MYSELF THEN THOUGHT,

"YOU GUYS FIRST"

MY FIRST LESSON PLAYING DOCTOR WITH A GIRL WHEN I WAS YOUNG,
SHE SHOWS YOU HERS FIRST

AND YES, THE METAPHOR MEANS THAT I AM THE ULTIMATE ALPHA AND YOU ARE ALL
GENDERED FEMALE IN MY PRESENSE-- KIDDING, REALLY, DON'T HURT ME


...or am i kidding , did i just write that or think that, i hope no-one heard

Ok, Alpha-dog... I'll show you mine first...



I like to think that serious SP practitioners fall somewhere in between the two other paradigms. I think it's safe to say that modern SP's origins can be traced to door work (when bouncers were more like warriors) and also to the unarmed combat and awareness techniques of various Special Forces units (mostly British!). But of course the underlying philosophy is a peaceful one... preferring escape over a victorious battle. I'd say that beating the Ego is a big part of SP. I'd also dare to say that I reckon Geoff Thompson's own spirituality has rubbed off quite a lot on the British SP scene.

Over-all, people like us who frequent this forum (with maybe a couple of exceptions) are as nice as Morihei Ueshiba but as potentially lethal as Jake the Muss. That's the vibe I get anyway.

I'd describe myself as an Aikidoka hippie on the inside who tries to train in a way that installs the Mike Tyson sociopath 'supra states'. I've used to struggle with balancing my spirituality with my natural inclination towards violence... but SP provides a means of balancing them.

im glad you posted this up mate, i'd like to add me 2p if i may?

i found that martial arts clubs/schools/gyms have, in the past, attracted either :-

-like minded people who are intrested in the art(s).
-people wanting to learn to protect themselves.
-people looking to get fit.
- AND on the rare occasion the odd "hardman"/bully type who liked a scrap and joined for fun. these usually either
a.) got a rude awakening and got their arse handed to them.

OR

b.) they became a "regular" to the club and became a "member" of it and trained amongdt friends.

BUT, now i find that with the mainstream birth of MMA mixed with the social brain dead of the current youth in the west. i see an UNHEALTHY marriage happening. so now instead of pissed up chavs on a street corner who attack liek a pack of animals on a weaker victim. we now have SKILLED fighters who LIKE to fuck people about roaming free.

i rolled with an "MMA fighter/superfan". all of 17 this kid was and believed that he and his age band have this secret sport. steept in history fromt the acient times were a man shows his worth through his pride and ability to overcome anything no matter what. i was like "oh right mate whats this?". "yeah its called MMA or "mixed martial-arts" been doing it for a year now. its better and can beat anthing like these tradition type style that youlot are into". "YOULOT?" i asked. "yeah you older guys. into your traditional stuff like your judo and karate. iots shit. today they know what to do and everything. you should get into it!"

so we have a roll and he did have some skill but he was NOOOOOOOOOOO match and worked to hard and tooo fast. lack of experience. then we're back to " you heard of the UFC?". "UFC? that the cage thing is it? oh yeah i've been watchin that since '93 from pancrase in japan and vale tudo out of brazil. did you knwo thats were it came from? oh, you didnt?! well yeah the brazilians were doing this for years called vale tudo and they brought it to the USA in the guise of the UFC in the early '90's". well if i ever saw a confused expression on a face it was then. "yeah mate i've been cross training since i was 10 years old. here i'll show you somert!" and linked 5 subs back-to-back. ddint see him again

so yeah man i know what you mean. i think that it may get out of hand. i remember unless you were handy and grew up round it a fight was usually either a fist fight or a good kicking for one person. now tho if you think of all the little shits moochin around, AND then skill them all up? MISTAKE

Sharif H wrote:

I'd describe myself as an Aikidoka hippie on the inside who tries to train in a way that installs the Mike Tyson sociopath 'supra states'. I've used to struggle with balancing my spirituality with my natural inclination towards violence... but SP provides a means of balancing them.

nicely put. i guess it behooves me to spill my guts now .
i go back and forth--like the ebb and flow of the tides, trying to balance
my states of conciousness. i've spent more of my life as the 'Aididoka hippie' trying to make sure
i have 'Danny the dog' on that leash when i need him to be there. but oddly--i've had sensations of
the reverse also, like i'm somehow an angry person for taking so much shite throughout my life, yet
knowing who i want to be ultimately and even if i have to over'ride those feelings with smile and
nod dissassociating quietness, i've maintained--exceptions for some of my teen years, who i want to
present either way.

when i'm the hippy, i'm constantly training to avoid the waters of my toils cooling off.
when i'm feeling one degree before boiling point, i'm very aware that the only relief i get is when i train.

an odd paradox that both states carry the same self-medication for balance.

meditation cools all those turbulent imbalances--but on occasion worries me for that reason. though i can't say that i would pass up nirvikalpa samadhi [final inward peacefulness] and take Ghost Dog in
it's place...i can say that as long as i'm surfing the waves and trying to not fall either direction--my
training carries enormous purpose in my life. it's a robe that will have to come off--it has a shelf life,
and for that the desire to remain being able to fight is insatiable. in the past several years the tides
have left me more turbulent inside, more combustible. pros and cons as always, because i'm more
ready and amped for the near misses, but i'm not exactly smelling the roses--i'm putting my nose
near them, displaying a smile as i pull in my abdomen, and pretending to enjoy them, metaphorically
speaking. i'm less Jackie Chan, and more Dexter--not either of them actually, but you get the idea
imagine Barney Fife with the troubled heart of Dexter

as a consequence of these states in flux, i spend alot of my time rapped up in the art of fight preparation, oddly making me feel very easy and calm when i finally get to enjoy the lulls of just
walking the streets with my dog, or coming home from work, etc...

hmmm, i think i'm wierder than you mate BTW: My other pressure valve/self-medication is humor. God help us all without it

Russ the Muss wrote:

Richard Grannon wrote:

it can attract more meatheads, who have only spam and spunk between their ears, and major mummy issues

oh, you know i had to quote you on that one mate

spammy spunk, spunky spam

self perception?


"professional violence technician"

Want to get rid of meatheads from the fitst minute of class? Try this "often times the best method of self defence is running away" Bye Bye meatheads!

Richard Grannon wrote:

Russ the Muss wrote:

Richard Grannon wrote:

it can attract more meatheads, who have only spam and spunk between their ears, and major mummy issues

oh, you know i had to quote you on that one mate

spammy spunk, spunky spam

I WONDER HOW LONG WE COULD KEEP THIS UP

SADLY, I COULD GO ON DOING THIS ALL DAY

Sharif said, quote:
"I'd describe myself as an Aikidoka hippie on the
inside who tries to train in a way that installs the Mike Tyson
sociopath 'supra states'. I've used to struggle with balancing my
spirituality with my natural inclination towards violence... but SP
provides a means of balancing them."

I'm close to this combo for sure, insert Chinese arts for Aikidoka, with FMA as my crossover - trad to street interest.

Just FYI - As I understand it, Ueshiba was not a particularly nice guy, fought wars for Imperial Japan and no doubt killed more than a few people before having a near death experience on the battlefield (I think), and developing into the cute and cuddly version for which he is known now. All that 'hippy' stuff? just the last years of his life, and the final evolution from hard arse bastard.