very very usefull in a streetfight..

no longer the link to this really good invention

Also very illegal to carry in the UK and can get a hefty prison sentence.

I don't believe in encouraging people to carry knives, just look at the UK gang culture, kids carry out of fear and then end up using them.

So I am against this kind of topic.

seconded

illegal etc aside. damn fine piece of engineering, id like to have one simply as a 'look how cool this is' kind of item. Altho $70 dollars for a plain one and $110 for one with a flaming skull on it is steep for somthing cool in my book.

Also disagree with it, doesn't bode well when things like this are promoted as accessories. I know, I know, it's a free world right? Still think it is asking for trouble

going out tooled up is not cool

...i get it, it's a cool piece of engenuity. all laws aside, my main
avoidance of knives--i used to carry them as a defense weapon
and my intent was real...so my main complaint ( i don't carry any
thing any more) is:

1. i tend to think of it as my arsenol--which i feel has a tendency
to limit my natural resources. i would keep track of it too much.
2. i can take my body anywhere (hands/feet/elbows/knees/head/etc), i used to find that when i didn't have my knife i'd try and have it nearby (which breeds insecurity).
3. when you draw a knife, the results are very easily fatal if you are
dealing with someone who is really coming for you. you're not going
to do silly butterfly knife play if someone charging in.

some people may have a good perspective of how and when to use
such a thing, but i'd think most will reach for it and either///
-have it used on them (i know several of these scenarios--those i knew
were on the winning end of it and had things pulled on them
-use it when it may not have called for it

i'd also worry that something that easily drawn would fall out in violent
movement. i mean, i'm sure he isn't going to fart and have the thing
fall out...but maybe during a tussel, it may be a free for all as the thing
hits the ground.

i'm not making a moral judgement, just a practical one as it pertains to
my sensabilities

people sometimes say they only carry a knife "for protection." What do they mean?

Not protection against a knife, because you're not going to fence with them. How does your knife stop you getting cut / stabbed?
Protection against other weapons? What use is a knife against a bat or a gun?
Against losing an unarmed fight? Not exactly reasonable force.
Against improvised weapons like a glass ashtray or a broken bottle? If you're training hard enough you're hoping to have the edge on that with physical tools.

The second you draw a knife in a fight, particularly in the UK you're in big trouble. Either you win the fight without using it but witnesses or police see you have it (not sure how you'd do that), or you use it, or you lose it and it's used against you. All bad results.

There is no positive out come to drawing a knife that I can see. Unless you see drawing, using the knife and getting away unseen as a positive result. personally my conscience doesn't allow me to be happy with that.

This debate has been done to death on other forums. Those non-nutters who carry, are convinced of their reasons for doing so. Similarly those who don't are convinced of the righteousness of their decision. And that's all there is to it.

yes, also in this forum are questions about eskrima, and this tool is very usefull in eskrima..
eskrima is also a lot about real fighting, and real fighting is also in this forum.

so i dont see your problems

i only like to show tactical thinking.. and this is a very good invention.

also if we talk about streetfighting and you post thing like i dont like knifes, etc... then you are maby on a wrong forum..

streetfighting has everything to do with knife, hammer stone, etc etc.

the chance of surviving a fight is much bigger with the use of a weopon.. period.

also if you re still in dogma thinking, and think in good and bad.. youre blind to the truth.

Who said I didn't like knives? I happen to carry a folder most places. I was simply stating the obvious, that being, those who carry are convinced of their reasons for doing so, just as those who don't are. I can see both sides. Trying to change opinion on this issue is an exercise in futility.
You saw fit to give me advice so here's some in return. Don't read something into a person's words that simply is not there.

I go by the philosophy that "it is better to have it and not need it, then to need it and not have it."

I carry both a folder and a gun - for work and personal. They are tools that I train with regularly - just like situation awareness and empty hand self-defense - pure and simple. From a tactical perspective, it is to "level" the battlefield if needed. Nothing more, nothing less.

@graig.. it was not ment for you

My complete apologies then. I was totally in the wrong.

no problem mate

chulodogo...
it reminds me, a bit off topic though, of this kuhkri (Gurka knife) i was
very fond of when i was younger. i never carried it--of course, but it
would sit a ways off in a safe place by my bed when i stayed in a bad
part of baltimore. there were many shootings around this place (you could hear them at night), and i think we avoided all that stuff because we had a dog. dogs were things to respect, regarding break-ins (it was actually my father in law's house).
i heard a sound like someone was breaking in downstairs. it was so
loud that i had little doubt about it. before i continue, no one was there
and it was just the way echoes worked in this house. probably someone
was slamming doors (or whatever) next door. anyway (an odd reaction
that makes me laugh now), i found my kuhkri, put it beside where i slept
in the attic (only one small opening to the attic), and went right back to
sleep like a baby. ha ha ha. i have since given it to my friend--the one i
used to write about who had hip surgery and was to use a cane.

i think when we all write for a forum, where we all come from varied
backgrounds (this i say on your behalf chulodogo), it is best to presume
we have all arrived at one meeting place where the roads that got us
here are irrelevent. if we start fighting each other...this i know from
countless dojo's i've trained in, the learning curve drops very quickly. we
are likely to simply over use the skills we already have imploding on
each other. i say this as someone who has indeed spent some time
fighting with people i could have spent more time training with. emotions
are great servents but terrible masters--an important teacher taught me
that. make of this what you will. regarding laws, this is practical advice.
regarding character assaults, this is simply not a good use of time.

Russell Sage wrote:

i think when we all write for a forum, where we all come from varied
backgrounds (this i say on your behalf chulodogo), it is best to presume
we have all arrived at one meeting place where the roads that got us
here are irrelevent. if we start fighting each other...this i know from
countless dojo's i've trained in, the learning curve drops very quickly. we
are likely to simply over use the skills we already have imploding on
each other. i say this as someone who has indeed spent some time
fighting with people i could have spent more time training with. emotions
are great servents but terrible masters--an important teacher taught me
that. make of this what you will. regarding laws, this is practical advice.
regarding character assaults, this is simply not a good use of time.

Words of wisdom.

Craig wrote:

This debate has been done to death on other forums. Those non-nutters who carry, are convinced of their reasons for doing so. Similarly those who don't are convinced of the righteousness of their decision. And that's all there is to it.

Adam asked me to comment on this

sorry, but I really cant add anything to what Craig said

I do think though that on this forum Ive made it clear that I lean heavily towards the "carrying weapons is gay" point of view just to balance the argument, my only fear for students is that they will see the weapon as a magic feather. Im talking as someone who has pretty extensive experience of carrying weapons. Note I said carrying, not using.

The only weapons Ive used defenisvely (ie no premeditated intent to assault) have been leather gloves and steel toe capped boots-which I was already wearing, obviously- or things around me- like door frames, bins, the bus stop, a tramp, some coffee, pushing someone into a kebab sick etc

We used to sell knuckle dusters on the site, but we dont any more for this reason.

Get really shit hot at fighting with nothing (the last scrap I was in I was in flip flops and shorts and had been drinking all day- thats the time it happens when you are pissed or ill or in high heels) like a vexed viking or a pugnacious spartan whose sword has broken... then if you DO pick up a full coke can, or a tennis raquet or a large black dildo your a fooken ninja!

You all have to make your own mind up with this one.

I gave up carrying when I realised that I was hefting around a sweaty bit of metal (or whatever) that when it went off I either couldnt access or forgot about or to use it would have been overkill.

So now...

My weapon is my ... MIND... mmm?
you see?
Im protected by my.... VIOLENT INTENT.... yessss
its always with me... ever ready...

because Im always... AWARE... yes, you like that dont you? mmm?

or is it?


not really...


...or maybe?

and without your MIND + VIOLENT INTENT + AWAAAAAAARENESS what good is your tactical folding nipple twister?

none- ha! see?





endorphins, sorry

Quote :

After their spears broke, the Spartans and Thespians kept fighting with their xiphos short swords, and after those broke, they were said to have fought with their bare hands and teeth.

if they had been real men they would of sacked off the spears and swords and got stuck in head butting and eye gouging and biting straight away... last man to be wearing the enemies DNA is a poof

Well unless they were fighting with the other guys' bare hands and teeth!

RichardB wrote:

Well unless they were fighting with the other guys' bare hands and teeth!

that is both acceptable and manly.

okay.. i keep my things with me next time.. but i thought it was a streetfight forum..
but okay, i will keep it bare knukle..
i have more tactical tips, from experience also.. but ill keep them for myself and students than.
succes with your good behaviour.

@ russel sage
yes i thougt we were here on the same level... but i think beginner come here also. respect to all.
ive allways be to brutal, at scool, army, street and everywhere.. im use to it...

Responsible response Richie.
There is far too much romanticizing when it comes to knives. This may exist with guns too, but as I have never even fired one I cannot say with any certainty.
Would it be fair to say that a lot who carry see it as an equalizer/compensator for small size/strength, or lack of skill? Probably. Would it be also fair to say that they carry with no true appreciation of the consequences of what can result if you did use it? Most definitely.
And this is coming from someone who caries at times, but who is definitely not what you would call a 'knife' guy.

Well the thing as I see it, is that this is a place where advice is given in a semi-official way, on an open forum. And because the laws tend to favor fair play, true effectiveness is often functionally illegal. Some times the best strategy is to be a better monster. Be a criminal as it were. But that's advice you don't necessarily want to give out to just anyone, on an open forum. But if people want to go down that path, it's a choice that they can make anyway.

I used to carry knives. I don't anymore though. There are several reasons. It's illegal. It's relatively safe here. And as others have said about carrying, I tended to focus too much on the weapon. And when do you use it? Mostly you'll never know how severe the situation is before it's too late for deploying weapons, and all you can do is the first thing available. Reaching for a blade at that point is a bit of a double-or-nothing game... With the idea that a blade should be deployed (covertly) before a physical fight, excluding that for all non-severe situations. What situations are on the list for that kind of response? In my mind groups come to mind, also armed holdups. with a knife in your back pocket, he thinks you're reaching for the wallet, but out pops a blade. But still. If it's illegal, you've created a terrible mess you need to get out of.

On a larger scale, it isn't only about winning fights, but also about winning (or at least not losing) in court. So keeping your standard strategy within the boundaries of the law tends to be a good idea. If the situation is so severe that the law leaves you open, but at the same time does not provide safety in some other way. Is it worth breaking it to give yourself better odds of survival? It just might be, but you do become a criminal and had better be a talented one or it's off to jail.

BTW on that tangent. Here are some of the knives I used to carry.

CRKT Bear Claw, with some modification (I sawed off a part of the sheath so it could be grabbed fully before drawing) It was carried near the belt buckle, as in the vid almost, with the handle down and concealed by the shirt. Edge-in, rip-cuts was the general idea. Another one was this one:

The 6 inch Vaquero Grande Which is a crazy-sharp and very good knife. All you need is a flick of the wrist to make the blade snap into place. I could draw that thing real quick.

But back to the point. What would a jury think if shown these knives? Especially if knives are illegal in the respective country in the first place. Even if they wasn't used, but just found on your person and all you did was go barehanded, it would give your lawyer a real challenge, to say the least. Those among other practical reasons is why I don't carry. And won't reccomend it. But if I thought I needed to increae my odds because of a true concern about getting killed without the law being able to help, would I tool up? I just might...