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thugsage
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PostSubject: neurolinguistics   Wed Apr 08, 2009 3:42 pm

how'd i miss this, really cool

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DssBkvsoXag&feature=related

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PostSubject: Re: neurolinguistics   Wed Apr 08, 2009 11:58 pm

Yes - great advice for life in general.
But, I do have a question -
Richie,.... how do you build frack ups into your neurolinguistics? The actual language you use inside your head has to be quite precise to be sustainable, no?
Seems obvious you don't want internal debate or less than 100% conviction to the task at hand ("Do or do not, there is not try!" Yoda), but it would not be realistic to tell yourself things that are blatantly ridiculous or become untenable after a cock up. E.g: I am going to do this handstand push up perfectly ... and then you fall on your face. Physical reality has to play a part in this to reinforce the dialog, or am I not getting the point?
I understand that we are more capable of things than we think and that our minds can be our own worst enemy, so our internal dialog is most important, but delusional thinking could be counter productive could it not?

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PostSubject: Re: neurolinguistics   Thu Apr 09, 2009 12:48 pm

...this will pale in comparison to a Richie reply, but since this a learning
process i thought i'd just put forth what comes to mind and see how much
it differs.

the thought occured to me that saying 'i will now do this', then falling shows several possibilities
to keep the potential fragile inner workings in check:


1. setting it up differently from a win/lose

-i've been telling that female domestic abuse student, in effect
to 'tell yourself that you will fooking take chunks off of him and permanently
damage him physically and emotionally' ...and not, "you will win and not
mess up your forward assault of a/b/c"

so what she will not do is not caught up in a web of things that are routed
in her deepest fears of being pounded and losing--but rather in the new frontier
of doing serious damage will little else as a focus.
you are now a bullet, from the explosion of a small thing, to the hollow point that
rips more as it goes, speeding along violently, to it's final conclusion that either ends by way of a solid surface (being k/o'd) ending it's course, or by way of having gone through something(issuing a k/o). fook the results as we like to equate them. her self esteem doesn't need the grief of focussing on
success as we might look at it.

2. having a stubborn and bull headed side that gets angrier and more focussed--incensed even,
driven to finish the image to it's perfection.

i used to surf. i wasn't very good at it. in the end i could stand and little else. i told myself to stand.
i fell probably 100 times, but i sware on all my writing that each time i fell i was cursing like i had
terets (sp?) syndrom. i was hitting the waves sometimes irationally as i struggled to battle against the
waves to paddle back out--on occasion screaming at the 'fooking-waves' to get back out to the calm
spots where i'd then await the next gathering wave. each time i got white watered in the gravel and sand
i was that much more indignant and blind mad to complete what i had in mind. in a fighting sense, i was
the idiot that got knocked down 9 times and got up for number 10 to stubbornly finish my image that
will get actualized, lest i die trying.

the first one cradles a fragile ego


the second one has such a monstrous ego that it can't be too beaten but rather is incensed and
boiling the furthor away from completing the picture it becomes--adrenaline starting feeding a fire
that gathers speed along the way, and not peters out.


not possibly Richie's response, but i like to answer things to see how differently we all process things.
i think it also shows perhaps differentiated interpretations of sound advice, rather than universality of
application

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PostSubject: Re: neurolinguistics   Thu Apr 09, 2009 1:42 pm

Thanks Russell,
Very interesting.
I agree that the 'win/lose' option may not be the best way to go sometimes - personally I tend towards literalism and like a nice clear picture to focus on, something to do with process and staying in the moment, rather than a future fantasy image. But perhaps this is holding me back? Perhaps my imagination is not big enough?

Quote: We do not rise to the level of our expectations. We fall to the level of our training.
--Archilochus, Greek Soldier, Poet, c. 650 BC

Then again perhaps what works for me the most effectively is different from what goes for others?
One of the great benefits of training IMHO is the ability to start being rather bad at something, and then with practice or 'perspiration' get better at it. It has always seemed to me to be an interesting balance of accepting 'not knowing' yet knowing you will improve if you make an effort. This positive, physical feedback loop has certainly transferred to other areas of my brain - and to life in general.
I also see alot of stuff as a game to play - not necessarily the mind set that SP aims for but I find it helps my focus and my ability to learn.

HAHAHA - good surfing story! I've done that challenging the planet to defy me thing too lol! ...... I suspect in the end, it was not me who overcame the elements, but that the elements eventually took pity on me and let me live!!!

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PostSubject: Re: neurolinguistics   Wed Apr 15, 2009 5:49 pm

I dont think I can really add anything much useful to what Russell said, the purpose is

1. send your body and your brain in the direction you want to go specifically

2. being bull headed and fierce and a bit japanese about the whole endeavour

"frack ups"? what do I do about them? laugh, fall over... last time I tried this I sweated all over the sprung floor , gave myself a specific instruction in my internal dialogue vis a vis the handstand push up, made a serious face, got my hands to the floor slipped in my sweat and landed in an undignified heap and pissed myself laughing Razz not literally, it would have run down into my face, unpleasant image

get back up, wipe floor, control internal dialogue, do it again, eventually muscular fatigue will physically stop you... but did you get more hits than misses? did you train harder and with more skill?

if yes: sweet dude, talk to yourself this way again next time

if no: strategy sucks, try something else

the only yardstick to measure the validity of what I or anyone else teaches is: does it WORK for YOU?

otherwise, bin it, bin it, bin it...

there, a beutiful English military phrase that you can use as a Combative mantra for 5 minute thug zen meditation - any thought that enters your mind "Bin it, bin it , bin it!"

this whole neurolinguistics thing came from getting thrashed in BJJ and getting really disheartened and wanting to give up (and in another sport that I occassionally like to play that I wont cough to on a public forum lest it ruin my tough image)- really the development of any skill takes time and practise, what are you going to tell yourself to keep motivated and to make sure your still heading in the right direction?

if you say in grappling "stay relaxed, keep moving, keep breathing, let the movements flow" then you get all tense and try and force on some submission then I guess this is a "frack up"- at an iternal dialogue level just say "damn Im fracking all over the floor, stop! return to the other programme" and let programme number one take over again

does it make sense?
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PostSubject: Re: neurolinguistics   Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:32 pm

Thanks Richie,
Yeah, what you say makes sense.

Quote:" ... really the development of any skill takes time
and practise, what are you going to tell yourself to keep motivated and
to make sure your still heading in the right direction"?

Ain't THAT the key to so many things!? Very Happy

Both as a teacher and a student I am very interested in how to generate progression, and I do agree, though there are similarities, there are also differences in the way people tick.

I am also interested in how seemingly unrelated practices and 'mistakes' can sometimes give you those "Aha" moments.
To use the analogy of eyesight - there is direct, focussed vision, and peripheral that connect differently in the brain. I'm wondering whether the same goes for the learning process?
Often focusing on something too much creates more and more tension - "I WILL relax, I WILL relax" and actually steers you further and further away from the point - the more you stare at something, the bigger your blind spot gets as it were. Losing attatchement to outcome and being open - soft gaze - works way better.
OTOH getting 'japanese' on someone's arse ('ass' for you yanks), single minded, pure intent is something crucial to be able to access when need calls for it. To fight through an opponent, or to overcome other mental difficulties.
I suspect that the 'Book of the Void', Zen meditation (I just wrote mAditation by accident , perhaps I'll coin a new word? Very Happy ), Being totally in the moment, 'I'm already dead', and all that jazz, is where the 2 parts come together ....?

I had another point about positive reinforcement loops, but I've forgotten now .....

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