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 high tide--low tide

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thugsage
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PostSubject: high tide--low tide   Wed Oct 29, 2008 5:01 pm

i used to read kahlil gibrain (i mispell everything, so get your laughs out now if i didn't spell that correctly). his main message was that if times are good, bad ones are coming. if times are bad...well, you get the idea. it just plays nicely into the order that seems all round us. like the breathing we all do. breathing out, death. breathing in, life. i think progress is like that.
one thinks it's supposed to be an upward line, but it tends to look more like the tides on the beach. up and back, up and back...with a big picture perspective that may be moving more upward, or spiralling more downward.

i have an i-ching tattoo on my left arm that is hopefull that slow and steady wins the race--constancy is the character. but i always used to picture straight lines. but if you follow the upward climb of almost everyone who does anything of consequence, there is the part where they tell you of set backs. i think that teaching students to fight, or learning fighting is alot like this. those that quit imagine straight upward lines of progress. those that stay with it aren't overly fixated on the successes and failures of the moment. it is their attitude of 'slow and steady' that actually wins the race.

my top student is has come from a difficult background. when i train with him, i'm giving him daily practical advice that mostly deals with psychology, with hints at willingness to engage--sort of personal space body language, belly tap kind of stuff to the young fookers constantly trying to add him to the list of write-offs they can dominate early on as they rise to their imaginary glories. what i can't factor in is that his battle ground also exists within his house. because he's a big lad approaching university, when mum raises a drunken hand to him, he's more likely to restrain her (not hit her of course). enter mum's new dodgy police officer boyfriend ramming his head through a weak wall, then promising an arrest if he doesn't fall in step. you get the picture. hard to advice from this place. he's not one to mince a story. he'll tell me what stupid things he said and did. and now they're threatening to pull him out of training--his foot on the good officer's knee, compliments of training by mr.sage.

so the tide is low again, and we strategize what he has to do in the immediate, and how later there may be time again to train. nature plays out another weather pattern, and all we can do is find the appropriate garments to match the conditions that encroach.
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maija
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PostSubject: Re: high tide--low tide   Fri Nov 14, 2008 12:37 am

Yeah, I seem to remember the I-Ching always telling you to be 'steadfast and upright'?!
There's some famous story, also from China I believe, about a boy and a horse. Something about a boy finding a horse roaming about, brings it home and is all happy, and feeling so lucky to have found the horse. The wise (of course!) old grandfather says 'we'll see, we'll see'.
Predictably the boy falls off the horse one day and breaks his leg, bemoaning the fact that he is so unlucky, and if only he had not found the horse this bad thing would not have happened to him. "We'll see, we''ll see" says granddad.
Next thing you know the country goes to war and the Emperor's men are rounding up young guys to go to war, and of course the boy can't go because he has a broken leg!! Ah, how lucky he is .....
Well you get the picture.
Sorry to hear about your student. Sounds like life sucks for him right now.
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PostSubject: Re: high tide--low tide   Fri Nov 14, 2008 10:03 pm

hiya maija,
nice story. i heard it from one of the swami's when i was on an ashram. i always liked it. nice to hear it again. the swami's used to say those on a path expecting only nice things will be sorely let down. expectations like that are the biggest cause of miseries. i remember one of them getting both knees operated on--wicked surgeries both. people were saying, 'i'm so sorry'. and the guy was like, 'why?'. ha ha. how's that for balance and perspective?
-r

as for my student...it happened just before my daughter was born. so the time away, will give the dust time to settle. problem is that i was training him on school grounds--he's still under 18. i had to let my supervisor know of what was unfolding because he was telling his school shrink. this will mean a big messy authority type involvement--more waves to negotiate. and a hopping mad mum to duck away from--me this time.
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PostSubject: Re: high tide--low tide   Fri Nov 14, 2008 11:26 pm

It sounds like your student is having problems outside of school so this may not be directly relevant, but I thought you might be interested all the same.
The subject of the right to defend yourself in American schools, has come up in an interesting way on the Dog Brothers forum.
Marc (Crafty Dog) Denny has been having a conversation with the school where his son goes.
Here are a series of his posts:
#1:
Crafty Dog: "My son has just started third grade and amongst the paperwork provided is a Parent-Student handbook. Amongst the many areas for rules and regulations are:

Racial/Ethnic Sensitivity
Controlled Substances
Weapons
Sexual Harassment

Most of these rules are quite sensible, but some have overtones of PC Nannyism. (In other areas such as Playground Rules, the Nanny State is on a full rampage)

The reason I am posting here concerns the page "Student Behavior/Discipline Procedures". In relevant part it reads as follows:

"Although positive reinforcement and modeling are our primary tools regarding student behavior, there are times when students need to understand that there are consequences for their actions. , , ,
"Students will usually be warned , , , on the first offense. Warnings will not be given regarding fighting, theft, destruction of property, and defiance. On these offenses a consequence will normally be issued on the first offense and will progress on succeeding offenses.
", , ,
"IN SITUATIONS THAT INVOLVE FIGHTING-- ALL STUDENTS WHO PARTICIPATE MAY RECEIVE CONSEQUENCES NO MATTER WHO STARTED IT. Self-defense is not an excuse to engage in a fight. Students who feel compelled to fight due to harassment by another student must report the situation to one of the school's authorities. The situation will then be mediated in a civilized manner. PARENTS MUST NOT ENCOURAGE THEIR CHILDREN TO FIGHT TO DEFEND THEMSELVES. This teaches children that when a problem cannot be resolved, it is OK to use physical force rather than reason, debate, discussion, mediation, etc. NO FORM OF FIGHTING WILL BE TOLERATED AT ------------
"Students many be recommended for expulsion from school to the governing board for continuation of offenses listed above and WILL BE RECOMMENDED FOR EXPULSION for possession of weapons or replica of weapons or narcotics or any controlled substance on the first offense.
", , , , A district policy has been established regarding all suspensions that include (sic) due process.

The part that triggers my posting here is this: "Self-defense is not an excuse to engage in a fight. , , ,PARENTS MUST NOT ENCOURAGE THEIR CHILDREN TO FIGHT TO DEFEND THEMSELVES".

Question Presented: As a father, how do I respond? What do I tell my son?"

#2:
Crafty Dog: "Well this matter wandered off the radar screen until my son's class was shown a video repeating this cowardly doctrine this past week. He came home to me upset. He feels afraid he will be thrown out of the school should ever he have to defend himself.

So I spoke with the school's office and made arrangements to see the video in question for myself this coming Thursday. The principal got wind of my interest and we had a very serious conversation this past Friday. In our previous dealings I have found her to be a rather level headed woman and I suspect she finds me to be , , , interesting wink so we had a basis upon which I could begin the conversation.

I stated the matter plainly-- the school's policy was wrong and I most certainly am teaching my son to defend himself. She countered with the to-be-expected. I told her I had told him to disobey the schools policy should he be struck, and she said he would be punished. I asked if that would include a mark on his record. She said it could, though not likely for ordinary scuffles. Then I hit her with a point that I picked up here; I told her that like all human beings, my son had the God-given right, the constitutional right under the Ninth Amendment, and statutory rights under the laws of California to defend himself and that should the school ever put a disciplinary mark on him that I would bring the full power of the courts to bear.

This she was not expecting. She knows I used to be a lawyer and it most certainly knocked her off-balance for the logic of the point was new to her. I followed up by saying that I understood that if she had two scrapping boys both hollering "He started it!" that I had no problem with both being given detention or analogous punishment, but any mark on his record would be met by a lawsuit.

We talked some more. She tried PC twaddle and I told her the school was teaching cowardice and I was teaching my son to grow up into a man. Eventually she said she would take another look at the handbook, consult with the distict bureacracy etc. I offered to help her redraft the passage in question and she answered that she just might take me up on that.

The Adventure continues , , ,"

#3:
Crafty Dog: "About 6 weeks ago I had a very productive conversation with the principal and got her to agree in principal with the concept of the right of self-defense. She agreed to have me help her draft the language for next year's school handbook. Today we finally got around to it.

Here is the language we agreed upon:


"FIGHTING: Part of a good education is learning how to resolve conflict peacefully and we take that seriously here at __________. If a student is being harassed or bullied, the proper solution is to report the matter to a teacher or other school authority. The matter will then be mediated in a civilized manner. Parental support in this area is particularly important.

"At the same time, of course we recognize that everyone has the right to defend his/herself if attacked. Of course distinguishing self-defense and fighting can sometimes be quite a challenge!

"In the event of an altercation, it is the responsibility of the principal or designee to interview all students who were involved and any witnesses. A determination will be made based upon the facts as to whether or not an attack which was defended or fighting occurred. Then the principal/designee will make a determination on the merits and as to suitable punishment, if any. Know that two children claiming "He started it!" is likely to be resolved with the punishment of both."

The Adventure continues,
Crafty Dog

The full thread is at: http://dogbrothers.com/phpBB2/index.php?topic=1405.0
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thugsage
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PostSubject: Re: high tide--low tide   Sat Nov 15, 2008 2:08 am

nice and pertinent, i reckon. the school kicks out all who fight. and at first, that's all people were fixated on. 'he held his mum down' without the 'to stop her from hitting him' part. he kicked the cop, without the, who had man handled him in an emotional mum's boyfriend way--to include eventually ramming his head through a wall--my student's head (a soft wall, but a wall). the people in the right places took my, 'he did as i taught him and used appropriate force as the situation dictated' speech with respect and, so far, without reproach. messy stuff, and the kid has a messy life. but i wanted him to know i feel he did exactly right. hopefully he wont get jaded and lose track.
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Benjamin

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PostSubject: Re: high tide--low tide   Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:19 am

Quote :
Marc (Crafty Dog) Denny has been having a conversation with the school where his son goes.
Here are a series of his posts:

That is a great post.

Fuck political correctness shit pisses me off Evil or Very Mad

Marc dealt with that in a very good way, as he knows realistically that sometimes fighting is the only option after other options are exhausted.

Initially I was taught by my dad to fight back if hit, and when I started doing it, I was the one who got into trouble and then every day from then I was told "no hitting and no kicking" when I got dropped off from school. I feel that had a negative effect on my psyche and no wonder I started getting picked on alot more after that.

All because the school assumed that I was in the wrong for fighting and didn't look at the fact I was getting bullied or anything.

This is probably why its taken me alot of work to get to the point where I can defend myself, because I had to correct that stuff in my own mindset.

-Ben
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chulodog

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PostSubject: Re: high tide--low tide   Sat Nov 15, 2008 12:12 pm

Very strange of the governement.. first they make you a sissy boy, later you have to KILL THEM ALL. if you are in the arme with skulls and bones on the flags.

The weapon part on schools i tottally agree.

i understand its much easier if nobody make a fight.. hey, but its life! soo deal with the reality.
Let the students feel confident, teach them also self defence.

nobodys start a fight.., and if they do.. it would be a more interesting one! haha cheers
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