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 Styles: life is strange

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thugsage
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PostSubject: Styles: life is strange   Tue Feb 02, 2010 1:05 pm

it took a while but i've so radically changed the way i used to
handle myself as a late teen--and i'm sure that my influences
were in fact the bare knuckle guys, but most didn't fight this
way.

i find this interesting to look at--purely from the outside looking in,
but on a personal note as it was the way i used fighting strategy as
a lad, short armed and agressive [and attempting to damage the
arms of others...but not the legs, didn't buy that part].

anyway, this is the only place i could think out loud

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFpEoMsW8kg

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maija
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PostSubject: Re: Styles: life is strange   Tue Feb 02, 2010 11:52 pm

That was a great clip, Russ - in fact I ended up watching a few others from the same series.
What I found interesting was the similarity between some of what he was doing and some of the stuff they teach in Hsing-I and Bagua - destroying the arms, drop stepping, moving with your whole frame behind the strike, alignments stuff etc .... wonder if that's a roll over from his TMA background or from the CQC WW2 stuff ..?
I don't know enough about bare knuckle technique to know what comes directly from that and what does not. Anyone else?
Thought it was interesting that he said bare knuckle fighting was called 'fencing with fists'.

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PostSubject: Re: Styles: life is strange   Wed Feb 03, 2010 3:56 pm

I almost wonder why the clip was labeled " Bare Knuckle Boxing Strategy". Carl Cestari was well known as a proponent of WWII combatives. Fairbairn/Sykes combatives were heavily influeced by the chinese arts due to Fairbairn developing his style while with the Shaghai Police. If I remember properly Cestari had a pretty direct lineage via Charles Nelson.


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PostSubject: Re: Styles: life is strange   Wed Feb 03, 2010 10:16 pm

Cestari was into a lot of things, bare knuckle history amongst them. Just finished a book I would recommend called "Bare Fists" by Bob Mee, on that very subject. Apart from this vid series, Cestari also mentions bare knuckle stances & blows during both his fairburn & O'Neill lectures

I know what you mean Maija about the similarities with fistic chinese arts, I suppose there are only so many ways to generate force within the human body. Stance wise, I was under the impression that chinese arts did not target the head as much & neither did bare knuckle, thus employing a looser stance, hands held lower. The use of the glove favouring the blow to the head in later times as the fist was protected leading to the higher guard (filipino source possibly?)

I think i brought up Jack Dempsey awhile ago but his style (he claimed) he based on bare fist, Drop step to generate force & a vertically held fist, striking with the lower three knuckles, again very similar to chinese methods.
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maija
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PostSubject: Re: Styles: life is strange   Wed Feb 03, 2010 11:25 pm

Cool! Thanks for the input guys Very Happy
Interesting about Fairbairn being in the Shanghai police ....
As far as the lower hand thing goes, seems to me that a great many TMA systems came from weapons originally - not all of course, but Hsing-I for sure, to name but one. That makes targeting the body more than the head make more sense and also the lower hand position you often see.
Bagua OTOH, tends to be a palm striking, as opposed to fist striking system, and though it is also a weapon art, keeps the guard high and targets the head as much as the body for striking and for control.
Looked to me like the hands were pretty high in the clips, but more forward than the gloved fighting stances of today - Bagua would be very similar except you would have the hands open.

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PostSubject: Re: Styles: life is strange   Sun Feb 07, 2010 3:17 pm

Had forgotten it was supposed to be a spear based art, though I was also under the impression that Hsing-Yi & Bagua are a lot younger than is generally assumed.

What do you think of Yi-Quan?
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PostSubject: Re: Styles: life is strange   Sun Feb 07, 2010 4:39 pm

It's impossible to know for sure how old some arts are - too many stories.
Traditionally Hsing-I was considered to have been invented by a Song Dynasty general around the 10th/11th century .... but who knows - at least it's not some 'mysterious Taoist in the mountains' as it usually is! Wink Very Happy
Bagua is for sure very new, around 1850, though again, eternal debate whether it contains 'ancient Taoist walking meditation techniques' etc etc ....
Hsing-I certainly uses battlefield weapons - spear, halberd. Bagua was designed more for guards protecting caravans of goods from bandits and for palace guards and so the weaponry is different.
Yi-Quan? Never tried it, though from the looks of it, the practices will make you physically strong.

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